WANTED lathe
 

Hi all
I have recently just bought the castings and boiler for a 4" little Sampson and I currently don't have a suitable lathe so I'm after something like a myford ml7 or larger. I have an 8' gap in the workshop now however a lathe that size would be rather too large I surspect. The rear wheels are 18" so that would be amazing if it was about to machine that however I can find other places to machine them. Finally I don't mind if it is three phase or not as I'm able to just swap over the motors if necessary
Based in Exeter so the closer the better
Thanks James

Bump

I may have an ML7 soon but are you looking for a used one or a restored one? I am just awaiting a new tailstock and then it will be a fully restored ML7.

Hi, I maybe interested in that, when you've finished it then I may contact you if I'm still looking
Thanks James

I tell a lie it will not be "fully" restored as I have not had the bed reground but after measuring it was ok anyway. So it will not be "fully" restored money so to speak. All new gears, bolts, washers and more all direct from myford. ;)
Will give you a shout. Keep an eye on here too for some good ones.
http://www.model-engineer.co.uk/

An ML7 wont be any use for what you want to do. You would be better looking for a Colchester master or similar. I have turned a 19" fly wheel in a master and also board the cylinder block for a 4" engine so have a good look round and think about what you really need the machine to do.

Ah right ok, I'll take that into consideration

BUMP

Get a Colchester Master,with the longer bed and removable gap piece, Its the ideal size for building a larger model,mine is the later 2500 model, I updated from a earlier roundhead master,wish I had done it a lot earlier ,good speed range,forward and reverse clutch,good range of thread cutting and feeds, used equipment and accessories available from dealers, Colchester spares are expensive,but so are most manufacturers,I also have a super 7 and a triumph 2000,and from my experience,the master would be best for your needs ,be careful with the early roundhead colchesters they are all 50 years old and they can be very worn,particularly the tailstock.Some squarehead Colchesters can be very noisy in the headstock gears.

Dingles have a myford 7 next weekend. Straight up the A30 to Launceston. i'm not going, decided to go to Internal Fire as I can also get to see my lad who's at Aber Uni

Thanks Nigel
Ill keep that in mind when looking for a lathe as at the mind as it sounds just the job, however sadly i don't think any of those lathes will fit my current budget however later on i could progress onto something like those.
Hi Terry
i had a look at ML7 at dingles but i think its a bit on the small size to be honest as i would get me started i would rather wait a little to avoid having to outsource much of the work. Also from my experience most things at dingles tend to go for silly money! have fun at internal fire, must head up there sometime!
James

Seems we are pretty much in the same boat. Anything above 9" swing is usually expensive, heavy and far away. I don't see a need (for me) to get anything bigger than 11" as it would be a one time deal to build an engine so i'm happy to pass those jobs on.

There is a 16" swing lathe on ebay down in plymouth, but its a combination lathe

Terry

Ah yes it seems like it, ill have a look at that as im after something around a foot swing as id like to think the LS wont be the last engine i build, however like you say its a combination lathe.
Im sure something will come along soon enough thouugh
james

This Dean Smith & Grace is not far away in Kingsbridge.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Dean-Smith...3D201443950568

Took the plunge and brought this today http://www.warco.co.uk/metal-lathes-...80v-lathe.html also getting some tooling included as they would do that at the engineering show in a couple of weeks. Yes, it's chinese but should do what I ask of it and is small enough to go into the workshop without too much issue.

Lathes made by the lesser known manufacturers tend to sell for much less than Myfords ETC.

This Denford is well equipped yet has not attracted a bid at £750 yet, a quality machine .

It is finishing tonight.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1618419154...%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Hi steamy one.
i will have a look at the dean and grace as it looks very promising and seems relitivly local, has anybody on here had any time or knowledge about the quality of the dean and grace lathes.
sadly ive just missed that denford.

Hi Terry
Ive got a warco super major mill and it seems rather nice so far, however its no bridgeport. you should be ok with that and i imagine it will be sufficient for you. I know quite a few people with warco machinery and they all seem fairly happy with it after a few tweaks here and there.
James

The Denford sold for £783.50, a bargain for someone.

Dean Smith and Grace Lathes have a good reputation.

http://www.lathes.co.uk/dsg/index.html

i will see how i get on, i now have several options so thanks to all who have helped. hopefully i will have a lathe soon enough

You don't have worry about the quality!!!!

Provided it hasn't been used by a monkey it will most likely be excellent.

Two points to look for:

1. Some models are prone to oil failure as most have the oil tank in the base of the bed and the lube pump is at the top of the headstock driven off the clutch shaft. If the machine has been left idle for a long time the gear pump will not self-prime and lube will fail. If you can, lift off the headstock lid and see if oil is everywhere - walk away if it isn't, as too much damage might already have been caused to the spindle bearings and the clutch. If this has happened you will immediately be hit with the smell of burnt oil.

2. The Matrix clutch is an oil bath clutch, but it sits out of the oil, so it relies on the pumped supply. No oil > worn/destroyed clutch !! Clutch plates are around £60 each and there are around 20 in each clutch - forward and reverse. If the machine is under power check the clutches are working by engaging a high gear and look/listen for slip. Mechanically the clutches are easy to adjust but many people over tighten them which leads to damage and premature wear. If the clutch needs changing you should walk away unless the price takes account of this.

I have repaired a few DSGs and all parts are available from DSG (regardless of who owns the company that year) - made to order. Prices are not cheap but quality is excellent. I changed two headstock gears and the brake on the 1609 in work and the parts came to £1200. Incidentally the damage was initially caused by a lube failure, but the real damage was done by the idiot who continued to use the lathe despite the screeching noise coming from the failing brake! Even this particular idiot should have realised something was wrong.

Cheers Carl.

WANTED - LATHE
 

Having worked for Dean , Smith & Grace for many years , I have to say that a DSG lathe is probably second to none .

The only problem is that even the smallest DSG - the type 13 or the 1307 its later version, is rather heavy for installation in a home workshop .

When I say heavy, meaning the actual weight of the machine - about twice the weight of an equivalent Harrison or Colchester.
So moving it could be more difficult.

As for using it - when properly adjusted , cleaned and oiled , there is not a more rewarding machine to work on. An older machine is capable of good accurate work if it has not been totally abused . Often a DSG was the best machine, and the most expensive, in the shop, so only the best turner / machinists got to use it, who tended to look after it as their own . I have seen machines 25 + years old used solely by one operator and still accurate as the day it left Keighley ! Not any Tom Dick or Harry was let loose on the DSG, but there were exceptions, of course.

All the gears in the headstock are hardened and ground and never give any problem unless run without any oil ! Many of the older machines prior to about 1965 had soft beds - Flame Hardened beds were an option and a regular feature post 1965.

If you are handy with a good flat scraper, wear in soft bed can be put right with a bit of work - not so easy on a hard bed machine though.

Many of the type 13 and some 1307s were supplied into training college workshops and consequently had little real usage or wear. The records of every machine built by DSG are held by the company, who should be able to supply details of the original customer and what extra equipment was supplied with it. The serial number is on the plate on the headstock which also includes the month and year of manufacture . This number is also stamped on the tailstock end of the bed.

The only real disadvantages are the weight of the machine and that the type 13 were never made with a gap bed and are relatively short - normally 30 `` between centres , although there are some 42`` machines about - these are a bit rare . The more modern 1307 could be a gap bed machine - with various bed lengths of 30 . 40 and 50 `` between centres.

The larger machines in the range - types 15 / 17 and the later versions 1609 / 1709 , both gap and straight beds of various lengths are equally superb machines but not so suitable for a home workshop

The other lathe I like is the Models `C` 10 / C 13 / C16 Holbrook - a beautifully made precision machine that can sometimes be found at sensible money. They were very expensive when new and were supplied with a taper turning set up and various other accessories as standard equipment and a useful speed range through a 3 speed motor.

A nice machine to use - the down side - they are rather heavy - with a cast iron base and they are all straight bed , ie no gap machines . Also I found my C10 3 speed motor was not too happy in all its speed ranges when used with a phase converter.

Other possibilities - the Smart and Brown 10 / 24 and the CVA . Both these quality machines were nicely made at the more expensive end of the market and smaller than the type 13 DSG . In fact DSG considered buying the manufacturing rights to the CVA as an addition to the range, but the CVA proved to be too expensive to manufacture at a price for the market.

MARK

Mark
Thank you very much for your post, it was a very interesting read and reasures me that the chances are that it is a very good quality lathe. I will have a chat to Dad about this lathe and see what we can do as from what you're saying it sounds like its the sort of lathe that will set me up for the rest of my life! Hopefully i can get down there for a look at it later this week as there seems to be a lot of interest on it sadly.
Many thanks James

Hi Carl
I will keep that in mind when i go to view it, if we decide were interested as it seems like the perfect lathe other than weight and that's only a problem once. i seems like everyone has had good experiences with the dean smith and grace lathes, and that they really are the "rolls royce of lathes" as the chap on lathes.com described it.
Many thanks James

WANTED - LATHE
 

Hello James .

You don`t say which actual model DSG you are looking at - the type and between centre length is cast into the front face of the bed , so it will be obvious.

DSG were always refered to as the Rolls-Royce of lathes - in fact until a few years ago there was always at least one new machine on order for one of the Rolls- Royce plants or one of their own machine back for a rebuild on the shop floor at Keighley.

So, if Rolls- Royce were satisfied, then I`m sure you will be too. One thing - properly looked after, you`ll never wear it out.

As Carl has said, parts for the older machines were available from the works, but a bit pricey. They were always very helpful with making drawings available and fixing up second hand parts out of dismantled machines if the customer was on a tight budget . I`ve not worked for them for a few years and there have been owner and management changes in recent years,
so I don`t know what the current situation is up there now.

I still have quite an quite an archive of DSG stuff, so if you can give me a serial number and where the machine is located it might be a machine that I knew of.

MARK

It is the one in my earlier link, a 1609x40.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Dean-Smith...3D201443950568

Hi Mark
its a 1609-40 which is apparently 8'3" long so ill have to get my tape measure out tomorrow to see if i can fit it in the gap. i dont know the serial number but i could find it out if you want me to.
Its nice to hear that Rolls Royce are still using machines like this today on tops of/ instead of the new fantasy CNC machines
Many Thanks James

The Dean Smith & Grace sold for £986 tonight.

There is a CVA Lathe on Ebay right now, as suggested by Mark Rigg earlier in the thread.

CVAs don't come on the market often as they were only made in small numbers and only in one size.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1117931347...%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Hi
I sadly see the Dean smith and grace escaping out of my budget, probably would have been a little too big sadly.
The CVA is a bit far away but it looks a nice lathe.
Im in no huge rush as ive got plenty to do on LS before i start needing a lathe so ill just keep my eyes peeled.
Does anyone know anywhere else to look for lathes except the obvious couple (ebay, gumtree and back of OG)
Thanks James